Maybe it is Racism/Xenophobia

k89bpa

I've always thought that the referendum was mostly driven by ignorance because both sides spouted so much nonsense, but more and more I'm wondering if the primary motivation of the leave side isn't just good old fashioned racism and xenophobia.

Why?

The lack of any attempt to form a coherent argument to explain why they voted the way they did. I'm not just talking about here either, I'm active on multiple websites, (mainly news ones), and I keep hearing nothing but soundbites, blatant falsehoods and people blaming the EU for what they see as issues when the real responsibility lies either with themselves or with Parliament and the electorate.

And what's ALWAYS the focus? Immigration and not necessarily from EU countries either.

I'm genuinely beginning to think that I was way too generous in chalking it down to ignorance.

extreme_one

This whole Brexit nightmare was predicted by Yoda years ago.

Fear (of foreigners) leads to anger.

Anger leads to hate (of the EU).

Hate leads to suffering (of the entire UK if they're subjected to a No Deal Brexit).

deadshot1

I was to young to vote cos I was 16 when the brexit vote was but if I was 18 then I would of voted leave one hundred percent .

techiebloke

@k89bpa

The two (or perhaps three) issues of taking back control of laws, borders and the reduction of expenditure were used by the leave side to hammer home the argument.

They don't need anything else because your average voter whose intellectual diet consists of reality TV and talent shows doesn't have the motivation to carry out the research for themselves and that's what the leaders seized upon to further their political ambitions (and possibly financial ones too).

Every country in the world has its share of undesirables (including our own) and yes, we need to crack down on these type of people but tarring everyone from country x or y with the same brush oversimplifies the reality.

Leaving the EU won't reduce the number of those on the move due to instability at home but that's too difficult to put in front of the electorate.

I think it's a case of many folks being easily lead which is of course always dangerous.

andath

Ha ha ha @k89bpa.

I'm moving in the opposite direction to you. The longer this Brexit débâcle goes on, the more I'm moving towards ignorance to explain it!

techiebloke

@deadshot1 wrote:

I was to young to vote cos I was 16 when the brexit vote was but if I was 18 then I would of voted leave one hundred percent .

@deadshot1

But what for?

techiebloke

@extreme_one wrote:

This whole Brexit nightmare was predicted by Yoda years ago.

Fear (of foreigners) leads to anger.

Anger leads to hate (of the EU).

Hate leads to suffering (of the entire UK if they're subjected to a No Deal Brexit).

@extreme_one

For those interested in history this is sounding alarmingly familiar isn't it?

deadshot1

@techiebloke cos we would be so much better off outside of the eu. Every year we pay billions to the eu . If we didn’t have to pay that we could reinvest that in education or in the armed forces. Plus leaving it would give us plenty more opportunities to trade with other countries. That’s only two of the many things that will make us better off don’t u want this country to be better off and thriving rather than being put down by the eu which they’ve done for years

pete2009

Maybe we are just fed up and want a change of direction !.

silemairin

@k89bpa

Niether myself or many others I know who voted for independence even discussed immigration , in fact I don't know any racists in the many people I know and know a great many

I actually did research and the final straw was when I read the Lisbon and realised the next few years would mean a federal state and I did not like the ultimate aim which was for a central treasury with a unified tax system .

I am sure that there was some racism for some but that is a generalisation ,

Lets face it the whole thing was a very big mistake by Cameron he honestly believed the vote would be remain , he was scared into it by the now defunct UKIP

eileenusher

@k89bpa yes a lot voted that way because of immigration and racism, I know people who were so stupid they thought it would stop all immigration ie Asians they used another word but I will not as its not nice and insulting I think, you couldn't explain to them it would only stop EU free roaming, they just shouted very loudly over me, but not all voted because of that, some really believe the EU is a big bad thing, if you get my drift and forces laws etc on us, when in reality it's not our representatives vote for the laws, they could vote no or veto then the laws would not be passed, but it's easier to blame the EU rather than anyone else.

sarahaxon

Ignorance or racism/xenophobia?

What a choice.

Yes definitely either or both, but also:

Desire for change

Urge to give Cameron/London/posh people a big kicking

Hope that things would get better

English exceptionalism (two world wars and one world cup, doo dah, they need us more than we need them etc etc )

Misfocused patriotism

40 years of misinformation and derision in the press

Express/Mail/Telegraph

The EU as an institution is hard to love - does the job but doesn't make the heart beat faster like 'take back control'

I'll take a second referendum if we can get one, but don't under-estimate how big a challenge it will be to counteract all of the above.

nefarius

It's nothing to do with racism and xenophobia I tell you. It's a much more deep seated issue. It's 900 watt vacuum cleaners and pointless environmental policies!

zakrs

well, in every country there is about 35% of people that call themselves...patriots and no matter what you tell them and explain in the best possible way...they know better and will never change their minds. That's why it is important to vote. But DC decided to do a referendum on 23rd of June when students are on vacation and many people without children take holidays abroad. Idiotic date and we have what we have.

mahooli

My housemate voted to leave because she hates the Tories and wants Snickers to be called Marathons again!

standardbearer

Well quite a few labour supporters voted to leave and I doubt if they were reading the mail/express or telegraph.

Freedom of movement is daft.

Work permits are ok.

A lot of this is on other threads

I dont think not liking freedom of movement is racism.

One of the reasons for voting to leave by some.

It does not affect me but ive said in the past that some areas have had cultural changes.

Some Citizens are ok with that and some are not.

Those that are not happy with it

Are not necessary racist , they just dont like change.And like you or I they are entitled to their opinion.

But there are racists and they are in all Countries. That includes the eu.

andyxhill

Motivations aside,it was the democratic outcome.

majorincident

A lot of people voted to leave because they don't like Pakistanis, largely because of the grooming gangs outrage, or not hearing English being spoken in the streets. The likes of 'Tommy Robinson' whipped up the hysteria because of his hateful agenda and the ill-educated rallied around his flag. Guess what, there will still be Pakistanis when we leave the EU and people will continue to speak their own language to each other.

andyslc

And bananas, don’t forget the bananas @nefarius

@k89bpa Clearly there are some who voted for who the issue is down to Johnny Foreigner but I still think that’s probably a very small minority of leave voters. I think pro Europeans have to shoulder some of the responsibility because the sort of nonsense shown above has been laughed off rather than seriously challenged.

I also dont think we can underestimate the influence some newspapers can have on people. The Daily Mail , The Sun, The Express And Telegraph have a combined circulation of over 3.5m. People still religiously buy these and hang on their every word. Of course when people are working finding the time to question things isn’t really up there on the list of priorities. Rather than ignorance or xenophobia I think we ve sleep walked into a situation where we are putting our faith entirely in political masters who have, in equal measures manipulated, and been manipulated by a certain stream of the media, with the bottom line being purely about the bottom line.

Well let’s give it a go and see what happens shall we.

majorincident

The trouble is though, the popular press tends to shout the odds loudest when 'foreigners' are involved in crime, which feeds into the prejudices of nationalists.

The EU is not the problem. The UK signed up to the club, agreed to its rules and a stay in the creation of new directives. The UK was also free to reject the ones it didn't like, such as adopting the euro or signing up to the Schengen protocol. This nonsense means that travellers from the UK need a visa to visit much of Europe.