This is the face of drug criminality, & this is just the west midlands,

only_justme65

Now times that by the rest of the country,
This trade is worth billions year after year, after year, & it is just increasing,
It's bad enough the drugs themselves are killing people, & getting people killed,
Those running drug trafficking in this country, those trafficking drugs "INTO" this country,
The use the money generated by illegal drugs,
Guns, ammunition, people trafficking, prostitution, sex slavery,

Is it political blindness that stops even the discussion of a national based, national organised drug production,
Where the production of these substances are regulated,
Drugs produced under strict supervision, sold in regulated locations,
Taking the manufacture, distribution, & sale of these substances out of the hands of the criminal element,
Same that has been done with cigarettes, same as alcohol,
But registered, produced, organised on a national basis,
All money recipes from drug sales,
Ring fenced,
The government does not get their hands on it,
They have proved themselves completely incompetent in regulating funding,
And ever single penny, used in helping those with addictions to reduce, & stop their use of these products,
Those taking these substances for their own use,
Whether legal, or illegal, they will continue to use these substances,
But the funds generates are not ending up in the hands of those who use it for more criminality, more murders, more deaths,
Money not having to be spent on policing illegal drugs, catching those involved in illegal drugs, home & abroad,
Reduction in crimes relating to drugs, and those committing the crimes to get drugs,

This must have been up on this forum previously,,

But I honestly think it is a subject that needs to be aired,
There's an election today,
& more than likely,
The utter lying morons that will be elected today needs to be having this conversation,
Solutions need to be found, as opposed to just putting up with it...!

I know people affected by drugs, people who have lost their lives to drugs,
Ignoring it, political ignorance of drugs cannot be ignored..

Answers need to be found.

caro120

only_justme65

if they just had mental health services that helped in prompt and thorough manner then that would save a lot of people getting drawn into self-destructive lifestyles.

we need housing, work, justice, clean air and seas, decent education and health support... the longer the decline goes on the more the backlog of tasks that need fulfilling and this applies to everyone..

williamwalker

only_justme65
The problem is they haven't even found a solution for the worst drug of all that causes crime,violence, divides families,
And takes up such a large amount of police time especially at weekends.
They even advertise alcohol on TV.

bazthebear2

only_justme65 This happens all over the UK.

alantony1

only_justme65 Drugs are damaging our communities beyond all recognition where I live it's been heroin then crack now diazepam also zanax. They bring misery to all.Theres not one family on my estate that's not been affected by drugs.I was of the opinion decriminalize drugs but over time I've changed my mind we need harsher punishment longer sentencing . But like most things the police need the resources to tackle this issue. Alan

andyslc

@only_justme65 are you voting for Lib Dem’s today then? Isn’t that exactly what Sinson was offering? A new approach? I thought you were Labour all the way.

For my two pennys worth there is absolutely no way that you could legally produce cocaine (for example) in this country and compete with the cost of illegal cocaine. Given that dealers already have established import and dealing lines set up, that it is widely and easily available and people are already willing to buy illegally, how could governments compete?

Cost alone would make it pointless and that’s before adding tax. The Portuguese mode is proven to work (certainly regarding heroin use) but it does require a complete change in thinking about how drug users are viewed, together with significant investment in support services.

caro120

andyslc

how would you say drug users are viewed?

i see them as victims, they might seem happy but the substances are masking the tears? some are so out of it is hard to know who they were..

maybe fun at time but always payback with everything for sure..

matthewhill1996

Not a subject high up on voter concerns

nefarius

The laws on drugs are fine just as they are, thank you.

Regards

A. Drug Lord

andyslc

I was speaking to a friend of a neighbour today who used to work in drug rehabilitation along with the police. They were getting some really good results after a long hard run to get the service up to speed...then the Conservatives got in and police had to cut £20m from their funding and it all disappeared overnight and she was made redundant.

caro120

andyslc

we had a good team and were working hard. I left in end cos needed more hours and then the tender went out to another group, it all needs to be set up again, do kids get continuity? must cost more to do all that than saved, nothing makes sense..

nefarius

andyslc As soon as you mentioned The Conservatives I thought of cuts and a subsequent failure in service. 😂

andyslc

caro120 depends on the drugs used and their reason for use. That doesn’t mean I think some should be criminalised and others not, just that the world is grey not black and white. I’m in favour of decriminalisation not legalisation (except for medical use and possibly lower strength traditional cannabis - skunk is a scourge)

Our current laws only views them in black and white terms ie criminals who deserve punishment not treatment. I dare say many MPs from the right of politics probably feel the same

caro120

andyslc

totally agree!

not sure of the current situation but think things have changed a little, it was originally tolerated, people turned a blind eye - when you see episode of Poirot around opium smoking, it is something that someone else did and they were left to get on with it? Slight bemusement.

then panic in society as dope was associated with rebellion or 'being different' - it might change things. People quite happy to purchase art or music created with the influence but people banged up for very little. I knew someone said he took the rap for a brothers pipe years ago, he had brief spell inside and it made his life very difficult for a bit.

Then it got to stage that a small amount of cannabis was just confiscated from what I've heard - didn't press charges, now we get the police themselves wanting to decriminalise stuff. Muddled change it seems to me.

In the mean time they prescribe opiates, codeine, antidepressants, stuff that is addictive. It depends who is profiting from sale of drugs I guess. Booze creates more sorrow than a lot of things I think.

nefarius

andyslc I agree that they should be decriminalised, not legalised.

Regards

A. Druglord

caro120

williamwalker

troub is has been around for centuries, probably millenia and slow killer - so people get born with dependencies.

you just broke my daydream! was thinking earlier about conception when people drunk, does that make a child more likely to grow up with any problem including alcoholism.. they say smoking near a pregnant women will alter the neural system of the foetus - makes you wonder...

andyslc

@nefarius illegal, legalised or decriminalised works for me. Just as long as people keep using I ll still have my cartel 😉

Regards

A. Druglord

nefarius

andyslc P is £250 a gram here. Sell it in the chemist for a tenner 😉

andyslc

nefarius you couldn’t make it for that and we certainly wouldn’t want to i this country. There’s not the market for it, not when other drugs are so cheap. 🤪

nefarius

andyslc How much does it cost to make?
Mephedrone was 6 quid a gram in the shops before it was made illegal. It's almost the same.
Amphetamine is a tenner a gram in the UK.

Mephedrone - C11H15NO
Methamphetamine - C10H15N
Amphetamine - C9H13N

andyslc

nefarius quite a lot when, as a legal option it has to be licensed, bought from a proper manufacturer with all those associated costs, if imported there will be some tax, plus any tax the government will want to put on to offset costs to NHS of treating people, chemists profit and costs, transportation costs.

Actually you’ve just made my point. If drugs are that cheap there’s no way government could compete on cost because clearly there are significant margins that can be cut by dealers to undercut any legal option.

nefarius

andyslc That's my point. If it can be sold at a profit for six quid, which it was the drug barons would take a colossal hit.
Mephedrone was 6 quid a gram including vat and the business also paid income tax on it.
People in NZ spend their whole life stealing from shops and depriving their children to pay 250 quid a gram and the dealers are creaming it in.
There's only currently one winner. The dealers.

andyslc

nefarius the mephedrone sold wasn’t licensed though. It was often imported from China. Once you start licensing things and insisting on qc, labelling, warnings etc the cost is going to go up.

You chose well with your example though because when they made mephedrone illegal the price shot up and dealers started cutting it with baking soda etc. The biggest effect it would appear though (because use tailed off when it became illegal) was that it helped the cocaine dealers who had, until its ban been struggling with the competition. At least according to this article which I found interesting:

https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/9aa53a/the-story-of-mephedrone-the-party-drug-that-boomed-and-went-bust